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Talk:Relativity (episode)
(episode) Just got to thinking... Should I change this to "Relativity (episode)"? It seems to me that any entry dealing with relativity (the physics concept) would be under "Theory of Relativity," not "Relativity," but I'd just like to make sure. :If there isn't a conflict yet, I don't see a reason to move it. If there's going to be conflict in the future, we could make this a disambiguation page, and move the episode to "Relativity (episode)". --Harry ::I believe that's already been discussed if we should even have a page to it, but as that isn't "Relativity" name-perfect wise, I would sugest just having a "If your looking for the theory of relativity, see: Special theory of relativity" or something at the top in italics-. Janeway's Time Travel In this episode, Captain Braxton says that there have been three instances in which Janeway used time travel and he had to clean up after her. He gives the time he was stranded on 20th century Earth for 30 years ( ) and another, a "temporal inversion in the Dekara Sector." I would guess that that would refer to Janeway's destruction of the Krenim ship in , or maybe the events of . He never names to the third, but I would guess that it is Admiral Janeway's interference in . I think this should be added to the page, but only after verification.Platypus222 04:26, 6 Jul 2005 (UTC) : The three incidents he referred to were 1.) Obviously the events in "Future's End". And the 2.) was the events of , but technically that was caused by Harry Kim. (We know this, because he refers to the Takara sector.) The third one is unknown, but couldn't have been "Time and Again", as that time loop fixed itself and wouldn't have needed his intervention. Same goes for Year of Hell. Wow, even if it wasn't intentional, it would be cool if the third one was Endgame! - AJHalliwell 07:04, 21 Jul 2005 (UTC) ::Oh, Takara sector. I thought it said Dekara sector, so I couldn't find anything about it. Also, since it was Harry, I didn't think he would consider it, but since it all goes back to Voyager and Janeway, he might. I'd figure that the third one would have to be Endgame- Janeway comes from the future, and doing so changes a fair amount of history (Voyager gets home earlier, the Borg are dealt a crippling blow, etc). That would be a pain to clean up. He might not have described it because of the Temporal Prime Directive. Platypus222 16:05, 21 Jul 2005 (UTC) :: There is the possiblity that the third major clean-up is the fiasco described in the episode 'Relativity'. 00:01, 4 April 2007 (UTC) :: It couldn't have been 'Year of Hell'. According to the episode itself, the destruction of the Krenim ship via the temporal incursion within it reset the historical timeline via the Grandfather paradox (If you go back in time and kill your grandfather, you wouldn't exist because your father would never have been born. As such, when the Krenim timeship erased itself from history, it was as if nothing had ever happened.) :::If Grampy was never born, how could anyone (me or anyone else) kill him? Back in time or any other way/time? 21:52, 22 August 2007 (UTC) ::::Year of Hell (the aired one, not the one Kes experienced) has to be one of them, because of the Grandfather Paradox. Either the timeline is forever bouncing between the two (or more) possibilities, or someone cleaned it up. EDIT And it's on there now, silly me for chiming in without checking first.. Oh well Izkata 03:39, November 30, 2011 (UTC) Nebula Class in Relativity? I just wonder where can I find a Nebula Class starship in Voy Relativity? Galaxy, Excelsior, Akira, ... yes, but a Nebula Class? Did anybody has proof for a Nebula Class starship in this particular episode? :It could be the one seen to the right of the Akira class in the first few seconds Enigmatarius 09:47, 23 September 2006 (UTC) Braxton Interesting, Braxton mentions himself being stranded in the 20th Century.... But, as I remember, when they met up with Braxton after the stolen time-ship was destroyed, he didnt have any recollection of those events. The Anaconda 04:18, 17 March 2006 (UTC) :He said he had never experienced that timeline, but there was another version of himself in the timeline that had. Relativity introduced the idea that there could be more than one "version" of a person in a timeline. Ducane said he'd have to reintegrate (possibly using the transporter) the three Braxtons he had; one from his point in time, one from after he'd placed the weapon, and one from before he'd placed the weapon. As they were all pulled out of time at different points, that action would have created alternate timelines, so it's reasonable all three could exist indepedantly of each other. Conceivably therefore we could have two Braxtons in Future's End, which once integrated would no doubt need rehabilitation... - MiChaos 21:12, 3 May 2006 (UTC) ::I think it could also be possible that due to the nature of time, in 1996 Braxton had yet to experience getting trapped back in time. Also, considering temporal anomalies are probably fixed as they are detected and detected as soon as they happen (or rather as soon as someone can detect them), this (1996) would have probably been Braxton's first encounter with Voyager. At a later point in time (for both of their timelines) the events of "Future's End" happens, as do others. Dominion transporter sound The future Starfleet transporter sounds a lot like the Dominions. Thought I'd just point that out. -- Tough Little Ship 15:36, 3 September 2006 (UTC) :Well it's a very different kind of transporter, considering it goes through time as well as space. Stands to reason it would sound different.--A Pickering 11:39, January 14, 2010 (UTC) Utopia Planitia The episode is stated as the first time we see the fleet yards, but a holographic simulation is seen in TNG: Booby Trap, aired some ten years before. Does this count? Wheatleya 15:23, 13 April 2007 (UTC) :Not only that, but we see a picture of it in . I think what is more meant by the note is that this is the first time we really go there, see it and not some reproduction or something. --OuroborosCobra talk 15:36, 13 April 2007 (UTC) Who Mentions the Three Temporal Events I had watched this episode recently and was pretty sure it was Braxton who mentioned the three temporal events but I checked it again to be certain. Here's the scene, Saboteur Braxton and Seven are talking to the Future Braxton and Ducane: *(Saboteur Braxton): Listen very carefully. The circumstances of your life are going to change in the next few years. You'll be sent into rehabilitation again, forced to retire, and it's all because of Voyager! *(Seven of Nine): Captain I believe your future self is suffering from temporal psychosis. *(Saboteur Braxton): Well of course I am, you pedantic drone. The only way for me, for us, to recover is to obliterate Voyager from the timeline. That way, none of the events that caused this illness will have occurred. *(Captain Janeway): What events? *(Saboteur Braxton): Thirty years of exile on twentieth century Earth. The temporal inversion in the Takara sector! Three violations that I had to repair. Based on this I've changed it back to say Braxton instead of Ducane since that's who said it. Gamma Orionis Should we add that Bellatrix is the Latin, not the Arabic, name for Gamma Orionis? Adam Bishop 09:57, 13 April 2008 (EDT) :Added to Backround Information. :) 00:16, 24 May 2009 (UTC) Just another discontinuity for background information? Didn't see anyone mention it so wanted to post it here first, besides Seven using the 29th century tricorder, did anybody notice that Janeway is using the Mark IX/X Tricorder her first time aboard Voyager, however in Caretaker and other early episodes they use the Mark VII? Its first appearance was in "Initiations". Worth adding to background information? Stardates Stardates in this episodes is given with three and four digits (52861.274 and 49123.5621), what is uniq I think. Something would be written about it in the article. It's mentioned in the article Stardate, but not here. 13:15, 21 July 2009 (UTC) Snappy Editing Is it worth noting that this episode contains unusually quick editing? In the scene where Janeway asks to proceed "before her headache gets any worse" the scene change is sudden. Somehow, making such a quick edit adds to the comedic effect. Such quick edits are rare in Trek, but more typical of shows such as Scrubs. Are there any production notes that comment on this editing choice? Winn cochrane 09:09, January 9, 2010 (UTC) Removed *When quizzed by Admiral Patterson, Janeway explains the name of the star Bellatrix as Arabic in origin. However, it is in fact Latin (meaning "female warrior"); she is not corrected. Further, Gamma Orionis is only the third star in Orion's belt when viewed from the northern hemisphere. From the southern hemisphere the third star is actually Zeta Orionis. *When Captain Braxton suggests that Seven of Nine be recruited again after her death, Lieutenant Ducane informs him that this would be her fourth jump. Once recruited, however, Braxton informs Seven of Nine that this is only the third time she has been removed from her time frame. (He COULD be saying that for Seven of Nine not to worry about that particular problem; after all, she is going to study Time Travel Protocols for the misson, and WILL know that a fourth jump causes disorientation.) *Captain Janeway has spoken many times about her desire to avoid time travel and paradoxes, once stating that one of her goals in life was to avoid time travel, but as Lieutenant Ducane points out, Voyager has been involved in several time incursions during its time in the Delta Quadrant. Removed as nitpicks.--31dot 18:10, March 19, 2010 (UTC) * In a continuity error, Admiral Patterson and Captain Janeway activate the EMH program. However, in , The Doctor claims he was first activated during the medical crisis in . It is, however, possible that at some point before Voyager s construction was finalized, The Doctor's holomatrix was wiped and restored completely enough that he lost any record of this prior activation. It is also possible these events were later wiped from history. * Another continuity error, in the time frame where Admiral Patterson and Captain Janeway are present, they use the Mark IX Tricorder. However in this time frame, they are supposed to use the Mark VII Tricorder like in the first season of the show. * In another continuity error, Janeway states it has been 5 years since Voyager was in drydock, which would place the time of Voyager's destruction at 2376 instead of 2375. Also removed as nitpicks. 31dot (talk) 08:19, August 16, 2017 (UTC) Redressed sets The Relativity termporal transporter looks remarkably like the Voyager sickbay set without the biobeds. Does anyone know if this was the case? If so, should it go in 'background'?--Indefatigable 20:24, March 19, 2010 (UTC) Why did they need to save Voyager? There is a temporal prime directive that prevents people from making unnecessary changes to the time-line, so they must have made the incursion for their own gain, not to restore a broken timeline. Or was there another reason? Also, how are there 3 different versions of Braxton? If he was arrested, how could he have caused the temporal anomolies on voyager? I can understand there being two Braxtons. The Year of Hell episode(s) showed a device that kept the weapon vessel's captain's mother's hair alive in the alternate timeline in which she was dead, and that hair did not exist. I assume this technology could be replicated aboard the relativity ship, in order to stop the ship from disappearing when a temporal incursion occurred to make a timeline in which the ship never existed, allowing them to make another incursion to fix that timeline. But the saboteur Braxton was not aboard the Relativity. So how did he remain alive? :This isn't really the forum to discuss episode questions, but they had to save Voyager because its destruction was not supposed to happen- it happened because Braxton went back in time, so it was to restore the timeline.--31dot 21:46, March 20, 2010 (UTC) I bet Nick Sagan wishes he could take a timeship back and fix this I'm new to the wiki and not a member, so I thought I'd post this on the talk page instead of editing the entry directly since I'm not really familiar with the local rules. At the beginning of the episode, a temporal duplicate of Seven is searching the ship with a tricorder to find the weapon. They even mention something like "at least now we know where it is." Later the timeship people take her off Voyager immediately after she's located it. Shouldn't she already know where it is? Is this a continuity error? 03:24, September 23, 2012 (UTC) :The Seven in the beginning died; they recruited her again. 31dot (talk) 03:38, September 23, 2012 (UTC) ::but heres the thing, ....if the device was onboard voyager whilst it was in drydock (begining of the episode), how can it have been planted during a kazon attack that happened some time AFTER voyager became stranded in the delta quadrant? ::im no time travel expert but that makes no sense whatsoever -- 06:35, August 3, 2013 (UTC) :This isn't really the forum to discuss the plot- but the device's temporal capabilities meant that once it was placed in a location on the ship, it was in that location throughout time. That's why they had to know when it was placed in order to prevent its placement. 31dot (talk) 08:04, August 3, 2013 (UTC) Deck 4 The device is repeatedly stated as being in Deck 4, section 39. But from the start of the episode, they try to access that area from Engineering. The door from engineering to the jefferies tubes is locked. Is there any explanation why they try to get to Deck 4 from Engineering? And why Seven would bother locking a door so far away? :In the future please ask plot questions at the Reference Desk; article talk pages are for discussing article changes only. 31dot (talk) 09:20, July 15, 2016 (UTC) ::It is not a plot question. It is a continuity and trivia question. If the writer made a mistake, it should be addressed. Logically it makes no sense to lock or attempt to speedily get to deck 4 from engineering via jefferies tubes. Unless engineering moved to deck 4, it's a continuity error. :::In that case, MA:NIT. -- sulfur (talk) 12:36, July 15, 2016 (UTC) Paradox? When the Present Braxton is releived of duty and gets arrested for crimes he hasn't yet committed (when janeway captures his future self) he develops temporal psychosis and becomes obsessed with Voyager and Janeway, creating his desire to destroy Voyager and his absolute hatred of Janeway (this is why he went in to rehabilitation and ultimately loses his job, because he can't comprehend why he was arrested for stuff he hasn't yet done). So he only wants to blow up voyager because he was caught trying to blow up voyager and wouldn't be trying to blow up voyager if he was never caught trying to blow up voyager, hence a paradox (possibly one of the types of paradox that Seven talks about early in the episode). We do see the ship blow up, but this happens after Starship Relativity has started messing around with time and unintentionally creates the paradox. Mess Hall Carey asks Seven to meet him in the mess hall. But this was in a time before Neelix converted the Captain's Private Dining Room into the Mess Hall. It seems safe to assume if Neelix did this, it was because Voyager didn't have a mess hall before this. The only way out of this I see is if he was referring to the shipyard mess hall, but that's obviously a stretch. Thoughts?